European Kayak/Kayenne XL
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Hi!
Anyone knows (maybe Helge?) if there is a way of tricking the XL software to do Double Take (i.e. split M/Es or Multi Program 2 on the MVS8000) or to make it to float the internal DVE channels around instead of having them permanently assigned to specific keyers?
These things should be doable since the US Kayenne and the XL has the same frame electronics. Or am I wrong?
Also when recording a macro, is it possible to make it to remember which state the keyer is set to? Now you have to do a timeline and insert events if you want to do be sure that a keyer comes on or off since a macro editor is not available.
Also is there a way of making an EMEM not to care about if a specific keyer is on or off?
/Carl
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Hi Carl,
first of all you're absolutely correct , it's the identicall HW !
The new , way more powerful , Macro-Editor will be part of the next KayenneXL SW. It's right now in testing.
In order to not have the Key-State ON/OFF as part of a KF , just disable the "Transi" out of "Define Memo" of designated M/E# and preset the things - you really need (e.g. TransDur, TransType, NextTransition, etc.) - using events. Or record a Macro (which sometimes is much faster) and insert the Macro into your TL. After inserting you can delete the Macro. Deleting is not such a big argument anymore , since you have 1000 per application (which I'm not sure , if there's a todays program exceeding that number J ).
Depending on the SW-Version you're using , there are new commands available for Events (as well as in the new KayenneXL Macro-Editor/also in existing KayakHD Macro-Editor) which allow "Directed" Cut's & Dissolves , instead of using "Fade-In-Amount" (which btw. doesn't allow to dissolve a certain Keyer in ON/OFF direction , without using looped increments) !
The way I create a secondary output is , to use one of the programmable outputs of designated M/E# (e.g. A=Main , B=CleanClean , C=Clean , D=2nd PGM-Out) and use Key 5&6 (in correct priority levels) in order to hide my 1st PGM-MainOut (e.g. BGD + Key1&2) and this becomes my BGD of my secondary output (of course I know that those Buses don't do Flip-Flop , but I take care about) . Now you still have Key 3&4 on your secondary output ! You're also not giving up your Utility Buses , and on kayenneXL you can also use Key Wipes as regular Wipe-Generators in order to Wipe your keys ON/OFF with individual Wipe-Shapes ! In order to do so , make sure "Multi-Mix" (in the upper left corner of designated M/E# Main-Menu) is activated , which will also activate the "K-Wipe"-button in according Transition-Module.
iDPM's are physically tight into the Key-path . So when you're looking for a DVE resource which can be routed all over the place , the correct answer would , use the option "eDPM" instead , which has separate "Sends" & "Returns" like former DVX or when using an external DVE . There's also a way to pre-combine any combination of Keyers in order to re-enter those as Fill & Key signal into any other M/E#-Keyer.Hope that helps &
Best Regards
Helge
Hi Helge and thanks for answering so quick!
When disabling "transi" out of define memo you get it to not care about ANY of the keyers state. But it would be nice to be able to tell it to "care about the state of Key1 but not the others", like when using partial keyframing (on your US Kayenne) or key disable on the MVS8000. I know you can work around it by disabling "transi" and create an event in the TL with "key cut direction on" for a certain keyer, but the US Kayenne/SONY way is mych more smoother. Especially when creating large timelines!
I have also used your workaround for the lack of "double take" or the SONY equivalent Multi-PGM2. But since you can't get the EMEM's to split on the panel i.e. haveing a primary and secondary M/E EMEM which is like having two real M/E's out of one, it is kind of a pain. Since it is available on the US version shouldn't it be an easy task to implement double take to the European version as well since it is the same hardware?
About the DVE's... Getting a production company to in turn get the truck provider to install an additional M/E card to get an eDPM is not possible for most productions :-) But do you know if it is easy to install the US version to unlock all the features in the hardware like "double take" and floating DVE's? ¨
A side note.. it would be nice if GVG in Europe talked to some operators that do large shows with their equipment, SONY and I believe US GVG is much better in that way. Like getting PBUS as a keyframe level so you can easily edit it would be great, GVG in the US has had that feature since the GVG3000 switcher and SONY has it as well. It feels like GVG in Europe only talks to truck maintenance people and European directors who switch their own shows and that GVG Europe then thinks all European shows are uncomplicated and not like the US shows. So I think GVG Europe needs to do some research at least about how shows are swithced in Northern Europe where they are if not more complicated than US shows. If GVG Europe did that, maybe they would unlock all features (like double-take and floating DVE's) of the hardware for us European TD's as well...
PS! I noticed it's not possible to put an M/E into layering mode anymore, like in the old software, maybe GVG disabled it for the European customers to not let the operators move around the DVE's without buying additional liceneces :-) But if you want a DVE on DSK2 but the truck only has a licence for a DVE on DSK1 you can fool around with key previews etc of an M/E to get a DVE on DSK2. But GVG might not like it :-)
Hi Carl ,
first of all let me clarify a small but important detail: I'm freelancing now for the past 20 years , working on variuos broadcast gear from various manufacturers , so I'm NOT employeed by GV or anyone else . So I'm really wondering when your writing lines like "your US Kayenne" ???
Anyway, I don't want to compare "taste" or "religions" , and what I'm posting here is just my personal point of view - so please don't get me wrong about the way how I try to find solutions whether they are fitting in existing workflows and/or mindsets or not .
And if it's all about your personal "wish-list" I'm definetly the wrong person to address those - you might have to consider to contact GV product managment directly - because there are definitly reasons (weird , strange , cumbersome - you name it) for decisions that have been made , regardless if they are bad or good - changeable or not . It's not on me to judge those reasons in public.
I agree that it would be nice to engage/disengage Key ON/OFF state from Transi - and you can be ensured that I've asked for that , years before it came out on other brands . But apart from that , on a fully loaded KayenneXL you're dealing with 260 levels of partial keyframing on a KF by KF level per E-Mem plus the range of approx. 1,2 millon Events per TL to your convinience. And for recurrent used objects (like for example Key ON/OFF , GotoTC , TransDur)
you can always utilize up to 18 Clipboards (Cut,Copy,Paste / 3x per E-Mem system) , which should ease up your work dramatically .... "Especially when creating large timelines!" So from my standpoint : even when it would be possible to combine every existing E-Mem model from all existing switcher brands, it would be far away from being competitive to the luxury and level of granularity of any existing DD-35,XtenDD SD/HD, KayakDD SD/HD , KayenneXL E-Mem system . Just my point of view !
Now regarding your
2nd PGM task (Double Take): I fully agree that this would be a "Nice to have" , but to be honest , it's not more than "nice" . I disagree in that respect , that the level of E-Mem granularity and it's programability can possibly limitate any desired functionality , apart from sharing 100 registers (per M/E#). I personaly also prefer not to switch between primary and secondary side in order to access them regarding crosspoints & E-Mem's , so in my case I can easily monitor the entire M/E# status. And again , that might be just me .
Talking about DVE's : The way how that was explained to me was , that these are 2 different business concepts : floating versus fixed ! I consider this as "religion" ! Floating is not a new invention , it just derived from Kalypso-SW. At the end of the day you'll always run into any switchers limitations , as long as it's not fully loaded/populated with all bells and whistles ! As an example : Having 6 floaters - and now I need 8 channels ? I'm asking you : What's the appropriate solution ? How about available Chromakeys , installed EVS Channels , CG's etc. on the production truck - are those numbers always matching the needs or desires ? You and me know we'll always need to find a solution for "getting the job done" !
Changing SW from XL-style to K-style (either direction) is as easy as swapping the CPU flash memory cards (MF & PCU) and according various key-caps ! But I recommend also to have a credit card available with a decent high credit limit on it , since all existing SW-licenses don't match , due to complete different SW-architectures and the way how they are treated/stored inside the system.
I'm not sure if I understand your PBus issues correct ? But you can send out any possible/existing PBus-Register/Trigger command inside TL's and edit those things to any level of freedom. And btw. those items where never ever tight to an E-Mem number (PBus Register has to match E-Mem number) as they are/were on other switchers. So ever since on DD-35,XtenDD SD/HD, Kayak-DD SD/HD , KayenneXL you can send multiple PBus Registers/Triggers out from the same TL .
And finally Layered mode : I wasn't writing about a single re-routable Key-PVW . In order to accomplish a thing formerly named Layered Mode : Goto Config/E.Box/ME#/Misc/ and set "Preview Output" from "Look Ahead Preview" > "Combined Key Signal". Now press and hold the "Key-PVW" button in MFM-module and select the number of Keyers (all 6 max.) you want to see combined on your designated PVW path (or press the according "PVM" buttons in the according M/E#-Keyer menus) . So create your composite with your Key(Fills) on Black BGD and re-enter the PGM-Out from that M/E# with split Key from the PVW-Out of the same M/E# into any other M/E# keyer .... including the Half M/E# . This allows you to "transport" things like Chromakeys , Wipes , iDPM's into any other location where this resource might doesn't exist.
And now I'd like to point out why I prefer the XL-style which is (at the end of the day) basically a question of my personal "taste" :
- after trying hard for years to be one of the "operators that do large shows with their equipment" I think apart from using all kinds of external interfaced gear , a built in RamRecorder is a "MUST HAVE"! Using high end graphics from a compressed video server which also starts to eat up Inputs and Outputs is definetly not acceptable.
- Speaking about Ram-Memory : Not having an additional DC-Power Backup is somewhat naiv . Not having "Real-Time Backup" is almost committing suicide in Live Broadcast !
- DVE transitions in general on the lever-arm or AutoTrans button (regardless iDPM and/or eDPM) since at least 15-20 years are "State of Art" transition types. The same is true for copying DVE Effects & Channels all across the board. So if you don't have separate DPM effects , how do you accomplish that ? Programming the same effect over and over again ?
- Apart from DVE Transitions : Living without "Multi-Mix" capability - and we're talking about almost 20 years of extensive usage , isn't appropriate either ! Keep in mind : Yes , it's the same HW !
- On top of Multi-Mix : How about "Offset Transitions" ? There's definetly NO WAY to create and manipulate any replay wipe faster - while not having a somewhat extensive knowledge about E-Mem programming , plus the ability to run reverse or even change the run-duration of the animated wipe ! And all of that without disturbing 16-Tracks of the embedded audio-stream.
- And for now , last but not least : For nowadays type of animated graphics a Keyer which doesn't provide a basic "Additive Type" keying (Sony: Clean-Key) , is in my opinion almost completly useless !
Now as a final little "side note..." : Of Course we both know that it would be nice if every existing switcher would have the exact same capabilities/functions/features (of course always fully loaded - with no extra costs) and the exact same operational concept on the controlpanel as well as in the GUI , plus interchangeable files ! But than we all would talk about the same switcher ! Hey , come on that wouldn't be fun either , we'd all complain about the same things :-):-):-)
Anyway all of the above is just my personal point of view .
Best Regards
Helge
Hi!
Thanks again for answering , and I understand that these are your personal views.
Anyways here are my replys:
Double Take / Multi PGM2: I just did a show that was previousle made using a SONY switcher, there where four different screen feeds (which is not unusual). Using the SONY (or if the show was used with the US Kayenne) it was an easy task. Now you burn four M/Es using the Kayak software if you are not going the key route. Now I had to go that route but it was a real pain. Since keeping track of keyers when you have to dissolve is a little to much to ask for if you are running screens yourself. Especially since you can't easily filter out which keys the EMEM's where to remember the state of... And since "double take" is available for "free" for the US market it feels even worse...
Fixed DVE's:
If you have done all the programming of a show and then the director suddenly asks for a DVE box in the lower right corner. Doing it downsteam would mean re-programming all your EMEMS since you can only put it on DSK1 or burn an entire M/E. Which is real precious real estate on the European Kayenne (see above). Again, that feature (floating DVE's) is free across the Atlantic.
RAM Recorder:
It is sure nice to have a RAM Recorder but if you do an entertainment show in HD with many bumpers, wipes etc the space really runs out quick. So running a Lance controller with four channels of EVS is the normal way of things. Also if you are using the RAM Recorder and the producer wants to change a key/fill wipe that you have used for different transitions, it is much easier just changing the cue in the Lance controller than changing the EMEMS in the switcher.
Now a new entry... European Kayenne Machine Control...
If you use Odetics to control an EVS it doesn't remember which clip you stored an EMEM with. It doesn't do Odetics loops. Doesn't have QMEMs, so using it in other EMEMs or Macros is a pain. Again why not implement those things for European users as well?
Now using a Lance controller takes card of all the above as well but it feels like it should be part of a swicther in 2010.
If someone from GVG in Europe as reading this thread they are welcome in to the discussion and it would be nice to hear their views of the things discussed in this thread.
/Carl
Hi Carl ,
so we were beginning this thread , when you where asking how to "tricking " KayenneXL" Software in order to do something similar to "Double Take" , and I've tried to answer your question politly . In the meantime it sounds that this is all about comparing egos ?
Sorry to write that , but I'm really questioning your main intention in that thread ??? Is it all about writing in bold type to catch more attention ? Or is all about what you like and what you dislike ! Honestly , it sound's to me , like justifying that you're blaming a truck-company which doesn't give you what fit's into your personal preferences ? Nobody in the world can be made responsible for that . And I think this is going totally the wrong direction since - frankly - I think this thread turns into a comparison between apples and bananas . Again , I've really tried seriously to answer your questions and I'm not sure why this thread is drifting into a direction which in my opinion isn't appropriate for this forum .
We both are professional enough to know that there is no such show in the world which requires a specific switcher - considering mid > high end switchers - to get the job done . It might be more easier or more difficult on a certain product . Anyway , when shit hit's the fan , you'll switch/finish the show on the emergency bus - end of story.
I truly respect your experiences while not having "Double Take" - period . For now I recommend to wait for the newest SW release on KayenneXL (I'm guessing here - inside the next 4 weeks) which allows you to do straight dissolves on Aux buses without using "Double Take". After that we might discuss again on that topic.
Now the DPM task : let me please remind you that the basic Kayenne (US-Version) doesn't have a single DPM-Channel (ZERO , NULL , NADA) and KayenneXL gives you at least 1 per M/E'# as standart . Now for Kayenne (US-Version) you can pick licences you want to buy (2 floating DPM's per licence) . So please do the math and simply calculate if the licences on KayenneXL - in order to upgrade your
M/E#'s/DSK's to 4 DPM's instead of only 1 might be a little more valuable . Because when speaking about price range : 2 Floating DPM's are almost double the price than upgrading to 4 DPM's per M/E# .In other words : 4 Channels float on Kayenne(US-Version) equals almost exactly 16 channels in KayenneXL - your might should ask for a detailed quote ! So please don't missmatch things the way they perhaps fitt best in your statements - we should at least try to stay close with the truth .
So if you think having a RamRecorder for you isn't important , I highly respect that ! .... but I'm not bying it . Of course I wouldn't burn a Ram-Channel in order to run endless looped BGD's/Animations for any purposes (sreens etc.) - for sure I also would use an external device for that . But whatever fits in RamRecorders , would be always my first choice , due to reliability , latency , embedded audio etc. and I can start built my effects before any other videodeck is ready in production (due to the matter of fact that Clips/Stills can be previewed on TC position inside the GUI).
Regarding your new entry :
First of all I recommend to use "Mediapool" protocol when interfacing with EVS , since it has a minimum latency . Apart from that , you're correct all serial Machine/Server protocolls don't save the clip into a Keyframe . AMP via LAN does ! (32 Machines max.) But if I want to cope with that , the simpliest way - and I can almost bet on that you know this - would be to learn a Macro which recalls the Clip(s) and insert the Macro into the TL (and delete the Macro afterwords). This also allows for changing clips without touching any KF content . And as far as I know : If the loaded clip needs to be a flawless Loop , this association is stored anyway localy on the server regardless which brand and protocoll (apart from AMP via LAN) . So if you want to use a Lance - of course you can ! And again , if you like Q-Mems and can't live without , it's your taste ! Not more - not less ! My personal opinion on this , it's "nice to have" but I can easily make a living without, like the past 25 years. And of course I've plenty of Macros and E-Mems left in order to compensate for that with ease .
Please note : Product Management for Kayenne (US-Version) as well as for KayenneXL is both located in USA/California/Nevada City/GVG . So the decission if ...... , or if not ...... , is not made in Europe at all .
Since you haven't responded to some of the missing small little - but important - details such as "Additive Key" , "Offset Transitions" , etc. I think for me it's time to quit this thread and wait for any new SW-Release before it's worth to continue on the named topics .
Best Regards
Helge
Helge! Sorry, my mobile phone got my thread wrong so I didn't see your reply until now!
Getting AUX bus transtions is great of course!
About writing in bold, just wanted to get the reply easier to read.
About the DPM's. what I have heard from GVG is that the same amount of of fixed DPM's costs as much as the same amount of floating DPM's. This could be wrong, if it is , I am sorry.
About using AMP over LAN: It's sure great but most productions uses EVS's (which doesn't do AMP). At a normal show, you try to get the EVS op to at least do a large clip with all your elements to be copied to your Spotbox. Doing all your clip events in the machine control becomes pretty time consuming , since if they suddenly wants to change an item you just don't change a QMEM , you have to relearn a macro, enter timecode (in / out) etc using the TIM/EMO editor. The Lance takes care of this as well, but since it isn't part of the XL I'd like to point this out.
I don't think any servers used (EVS's etc) can load a clip from a remote controller and receive another trigger to put into an endless loop without the external controller maintains control of the loop. Since the XL lacks the capability of doing Odetics loops, how do you them if you don't have the resources of getting another playback device (which is $$ to the show) that just do your loops and nothing else?
Also, additive keying is naturally a good thing but you can easilly change this in the input configuration on all GVG switchers since the 3000.
Sorry, I have never used Off-set transitions, I think it's easier to use a macro or a timeline, then you have total control of your keyers and RAM-Recorders. But I understand it is a great thing for a smaller show.
Carl -
As it looks like Helge has finished with this thread, let me add a few thoughts that might help you understand why there are such differences between the XL & the K versions of the Kayenne: When Helge, myself, and two others began the design of what is now Kayenne, the original intent was to get away from the Thomson mentality that they carry 2 product lines...one for the American market, and one for everybody else. Kalypsos did not sell well in Europe, and ExtenDDs did not sell well in the U.S. While it is true that the hardware on virtually ANY switcher lets you do pretty much anything on one product that you can do on another product, it's the software that gives each switcher its personality. The general requirements for switchers in Europe & Asia are very much different than the requirements for use in the Americas. The original intent for (what is now) Kayenne was to create a "world" switcher that incorporated the best design features of the GV, BTS, SONY, and ROSS products - roll everything up into ONE package, and offer that to everybody. The reality is that the U.S. operators constitute less than 40% of the worldwide market, and so the plan was to "ease them in" to conventions that were already accepted in the majority of the marketplace. For example, the Kayenne's ability to turn on & off specific parts of an E-MEM on a keyframe-by-keyframe basis is nothing more than the DD-35's timEMEMo, and the ability for any one M/E to control more than itself is also from the DD-series: The ability to put the same keyer on both the Primary as well as the Secondary partition was a direct result of SONY's Multi-Program.
When Helge & I left the original design team, the new team that came in (coupled with the fact that management of the product was based in Nevada City, not Europe) was much more Kalypso-centric. Rather than design the menu overlay (which runs the Kayak frame, which "thinks" in DD) to bring U.S. operators more into the worldwide mentality, the decision was apparently made to make current Kalypso operators feel more at home - a job that from what I understand, they did a good job at accomplishing. However, in making the Kayenne more Kalypso-ish, certain other flexibilities that are inheirent in the DD series had to be either modified or abandonded. U.S. operators would not miss some of these features, but the rest of the world would; thus the decision for an XL panel to run more of the DD-based software that the majority of the world apparently prefers. For example, the RAM Recorder software was designed to work in the DD series of switchers, and so the XL (which is DD-based) can handle this feature, while the K version's software can't make it work - thus the decision to incorporate servers (a feature that, by the way, every other switcher can do) in place of the RAM Recorder along with the Marketing spin that "you get more space for your clips" (this hype bothers me, because if this feature were that important, why did Kalypso push the whole idea of Still Store animations as a replacement for needing servers in the 1st place?). Every switcher talks to servers - maybe the new interface is cleaner, but the idea is not new. The DD series uses nomenclature such as + & - keying...GV operators know this as multiplicative and additive keying...SONY calls it "Clean Key" - but the end result is the same, regardless of what you call it.
So with the Kayenne becoming more "U.S.-friendly", it was clear that European & many other broadcasters would not embrace this "Kalypso-redeaux". Thus the decision by some in Europe to break off & simultaneously develop a more DD-like product to maintain their edge in Europe. This design was in development long before the U.S. team jumped on-board. So the XL is more of what European users expect, and has been designed to meet the overall needs of the majority of the broadcast world.
That being said, the XL (with its software being designed in Europe and written for the majority of needs of the World Market) does not do everything that the K version will do, and the K version can't do everything that the XL can do. And because of the fact that you basically have 2 separate design teams (one for the K & one for the XL) who each have their own separate ideas of what their markets require, I would sincerely doubt that you're ever going to get what you are asking for. Double-Take may be a wonderful thing & may be indispensible for many of us TD's, but the rest of the world gets along just fine without it. Or else they find workarounds. And frankly, that's what separates good TD's from the rest...the ability to learn new interfaces and to make one switcher do the same things that another switcher can do The biggest complaint that I hear from GV operators who hop on a SONY is "is doesn't work like a Grass" - well, duh...it's a different product - it has some superior features (and some inferior features, too), but the user interface requires the operator to LEARN the product & to work around interface convention differences. The XL & the K versions are both Kayenne hardware, but they are as operationally different as a Ford Crown Victoria & a Lincoln Towncar (which are both built on the same chassis). Each product addresses different user and broadcast requirements, and each does so remarkably well. Helge is still involved with development in the European region, and I can understand how he can get annoyed with those who put down a product that he's involved with just because it "doesn't do everything that they would expect it to do" - he does some of the biggest shows in Europe...he does them differently than how they would be done in the U.S., but they get done & everybody involved is happy.
Our original goal of the Kayenne's design being able to fit the needs and tastes of every operator everywhere went away when the original design team disbanded...we took most of our advanced design ideas with us when we left. There is no current switcher from ANY manufacturer that is "everything to everybody" - if a company did that, they would be able to put every other competitor out of business. And until you get a truly international team of expert users who can work together & agree to design such a product, this goal is not likely to happen - we were on track for that with Kayenne, but in the end it didn't happen...hence the 2 software versions. So while I can understand your frustration on not being able to utilize features that seem like "no-brainers" on what seem like similar products, I would suggest (not that you want to hear this) that you either find workarounds on the software that you're using, or consider trying to find a way to carry & load the K version of software when you get on an XL. I only suggest that because with the recent purchase of GV by a venture-capital firm and the impending accompanying "re-adjustments" in worldwide staffing & resources, I would sincerely doubt that you'll see any merging of software between the two different products (and they ARE different products) any time soon; if ever.
Thanks for the reply Bob!
I do think it's strange that GVG thinks there is that big difference in how american and European (at least North European) TD's work. Since most formats are from the US and there're not too many ways of doing the same show.
Doing sports without double take (or multi-program2) makes it a real workaround show with all different the cleanfeeds you have to send out. Not to mention doing an entertainment show with multiple screen feeds and no screens TD.
But I agree with Bob. If you're a good TD you find your way around, that's our job. :-)
When the DD35 from Philips / Thomson came out it was a big breakthrough with macros, timeline editing etc compared with GVG and SONY. But it feels like the development pretty much has stood still, comparing the XL with DD35 the only things that has changed are the addtion of the RAM Recorder and the internal DVE's (iDPM).
Now SONY has been advancing in the North European markets thanks to the features the XL lacks (which of course SONY is quick to point out). SONY of course lacks some features of the XL but the SONY Frame Memory is really much quicker and easier to work with than the RAM Recorder (which is heavily touted by GVG). Especially with the new software that lets you cut out matte/fill clips automaticly. But that's just my ten cents, there other operators who prefers the Ram Recorder.
I Dont work for GVG.
Just to chip in here you keep refering to the US vs Euro versions and saying all of this is free with the US versions. This is not really true.
There is the Kayenne which runs the "Kalypso" software and then there is the Kayenne XL which runs the "Kayak" software. One is more expensive than the other. Can you guess which one ;)
Oh and you talk about the QMEMS well the "puck" module is not free and actually costs more than a Lance so in the NA market you still see lances with the Kayenne. Also since the Kayenne does not have VDCP there are some servers that you need the Lance for anyway--yet the XL does support this interface. The XL also supports ESAMII and Probel Routers the Kayenne does not.
I agree that the RamRecorder is no longer enough in this heavy Wipe/Sponsored days but it is nice to be able to both ;)
Hi Les!
According to GVG the Kayenne and Kayenne XL is the same price in similair configuration.
And I know the machine control panel is expensive but it costs the same amount whether you have the US or European versions of the software. I just wanted to explain that you buy the same machine control module for the same price but get limited functionality in Europe.
VDCP is nice but since you can't store an EMEM with clipinfo, gang and timecode. Without that, it's real cumbersome to use.
Then, my personal preference is the Lance controller, so it's not really a big issue for me :-)
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