[quote="scottgfx"][quote="brad fisher"]The resultant key on the M/E is already Shaped, and I don't think there's a way of telling the Kalypso that.[/quote] That sounds strange knowing that I think GVG invented the term "Shaped" video.[/quote] The "Shaped / Unshaped" attribute of a key is specified in the Eng Setup "input" menu. Since the M/Es are not inputs, you can't create a Source that always uses an M/E as a key signal and is always set as a Shaped key. You have to do it as a "Key Split", and I /THINK/ that if an M/E is used as a key split, it takes the Shaped/Unshaped attribute of the source which is on the BKGD-A row (but I haven't tested this).

[quote="Bill D"]Although I loved the workaround by Brad still :)[/quote] You're absolutely right! JP

[quote="5mars"][quote="Mike Cumbo"]Bill, as I look at V12.0.1 on my PC at home there is a Layered option in the M/E Mode section. there is a Primary and a Secondary button. I do not know if it is indeed active, since I haven't been on a Kalypso recently.[/quote] I tried it and it works well, and easy to use (easier than Brad's way!). That means that you can have up to 12 (even 15 if you also split your PGM/PST ME) keyers on a single button.[/quote] This is great, probably should have been on version 1 in my opinion, but better late then never. This is on the Duo and Classic right?? Although I loved the workaround by Brad still :)

[quote="Mike Cumbo"]Bill, as I look at V12.0.1 on my PC at home there is a Layered option in the M/E Mode section. there is a Primary and a Secondary button. I do not know if it is indeed active, since I haven't been on a Kalypso recently.[/quote] I tried it and it works well, and easy to use (easier than Brad's way!). That means that you can have up to 12 keyers on a single button.

Bill, as I look at V12.0.1 on my PC at home there is a Layered option in the M/E Mode section. there is a Primary and a Secondary button. I do not know if it is indeed active, since I haven't been on a Kalypso recently.

[quote="5mars"][quote="brad fisher"]Bill You can set the "Show Key" button (in the menu) for each of your two "layer" keys on an M/E brad[/quote] Brad, great idea! V 12 makes it easier: if you have the double take option, you go to ME mode, choose split mode, assign the keys to the partition you want to be in the layered mode (it can be either the primary or the secondary or both of them), and put the partition in layered mode. JP[/quote] So are you saying there is now a true layered mode? Or are you referencing Brad's way of making a quasi layered mode which seems would definitly work. Bill

[quote="brad fisher"]Bill You can set the "Show Key" button (in the menu) for each of your two "layer" keys on an M/E brad[/quote] Brad, great idea! V 12 makes it easier: if you have the double take option, you go to ME mode, choose split mode, assign the keys to the partition you want to be in the layered mode (it can be either the primary or the secondary or both of them), and put the partition in layered mode. JP

[quote="Bill D"]The two objects that go into the TE are square and opaque. Wonder how noticeable the shaping will be, might be fine b/c no transparency.[/quote] Correct. In this case the key would be 100% and therefore there would be no blending of the keyed source and program. With opaque objects, the fill is identical whether it's shaped or unshaped- The exception being graphics with anti-aliasing where there are pixels of varying transparency on curved edges. You're livin' large since you're dealing with square objects.

[quote="brad fisher"]Bill You can set the "Show Key" button (in the menu) for each of your two "layer" keys on an M/E (say, M/E1). This puts a white key signal of both keyers on the preview output for M/E1, (M1pA). You'd have probably have Black as the background. M/E1 would be selected as the fill on Pgm/Pst, and a Split Key done using M1pA as the key signal. A similar thing could be done using the Secondary partition of M/E1, and using M1B and M1p2 as the fill and key. This allows you to still use M/E1 for some other purpose, using the remaining 2 keyers. One watchpoint would be that you shouldn't use the "Show Key" pushbutton on the main panel, as I think it will unlatch the Show Key mode from the Menu. You might also be limited if you were using the Chromakey "Auto Setup" on M/E1, as well as the Safe Title generator for M/E1. The resultant key on the M/E is already Shaped, and I don't think there's a way of telling the Kalypso that. This will have the effect of making "semi-transparent" parts of a key dark; the same with soft edges. If you had 2 loopbacks (ie, 2 video outputs re-entered as input sources), you could configure a new Kalypso source and tell the system that it was already Shaped, and so soft edges would be preserved correctly. Remember that a loopback adds one line of delay, moving the picture downwards. Getting the key signal to follow can be done automatically if you have the loopbacks, or easily of you use a Macro, or moderately easily if you operate with "Source Memory" active, or manually using the Key Split modifier. Hope this helps brad[/quote] Brad great info, few points to make sure I have this. As far as the chroma key auto setup and safe title, this is because it would show up on the preview out I assume? I like the idea of using the secondary partition of the ME. Could assign that to another level I believe and make that part of the emem. I don't love source memory on (can you have it on for only some sources), so I think a macro that does the split key, sets up source on my pgm/pst key row, and changes the key priority would work. I can't touch pgm/pst b/c the state will be unknown. My TE's can run up in ME 1 secondary and key on pgm/pst along with a profile trans. This will make things a lot easier then going up to an ME everytime to do this effect. The two objects that go into the TE are square and opaque. Wonder how noticeable the shaping will be, might be fine b/c no transparency. Not sure if there are available inputs for a loopback thanks Bill

[quote="brad fisher"]The resultant key on the M/E is already Shaped, and I don't think there's a way of telling the Kalypso that.[/quote] That sounds strange knowing that I think GVG invented the term "Shaped" video. (Just FYI, in the computer VFX world, it's known as "Pre-multiplied Alpha". That may help when you are having to translate :) ) I've never used a Kalypso, but I do know that my beloved Kaleidoscope had both the ability to Unshape a key going into it, or to provide an Unshaped output... even for the analog keyers of our 300. I also know that the keyers on my GVG 1000 had an option to unshape an input on it's keyers. (An engineering setup not accessible to a mortal) I would think it odd if the Kalypso didn't provide similar options... Then again, you are talking about looping composites inside the switcher and that's probably a whole other kettle of fish.

Bill You can set the "Show Key" button (in the menu) for each of your two "layer" keys on an M/E (say, M/E1). This puts a white key signal of both keyers on the preview output for M/E1, (M1pA). You'd have probably have Black as the background. M/E1 would be selected as the fill on Pgm/Pst, and a Split Key done using M1pA as the key signal. A similar thing could be done using the Secondary partition of M/E1, and using M1B and M1p2 as the fill and key. This allows you to still use M/E1 for some other purpose, using the remaining 2 keyers. One watchpoint would be that you shouldn't use the "Show Key" pushbutton on the main panel, as I think it will unlatch the Show Key mode from the Menu. You might also be limited if you were using the Chromakey "Auto Setup" on M/E1, as well as the Safe Title generator for M/E1. The resultant key on the M/E is already Shaped, and I don't think there's a way of telling the Kalypso that. This will have the effect of making "semi-transparent" parts of a key dark; the same with soft edges. If you had 2 loopbacks (ie, 2 video outputs re-entered as input sources), you could configure a new Kalypso source and tell the system that it was already Shaped, and so soft edges would be preserved correctly. Remember that a loopback adds one line of delay, moving the picture downwards. Getting the key signal to follow can be done automatically if you have the loopbacks, or easily of you use a Macro, or moderately easily if you operate with "Source Memory" active, or manually using the Key Split modifier. Hope this helps brad